Alternate/Parallel W3 'worlds'

[rielle]

Okay, its quarter to two am here, and I've got another idea buzzing in my otherwise much bemused brain.

One theme or concept that we see in sci-fi and I use the term deliberately, and that I've seen in some fandom's fanfiction is of Alternate or Parallel Universes/Worlds in which the familiar characters find themselves in ALMOST familiar places, but come to find out sooner or later that they've wandered into/onto a parallel existence.

I've even read one W3fic that worked with this premise, but not only was it just a platform for a plotline that just didn't fly, it painted a really dreary alternate world... yeah, gloomier even than Dickens and Dostoevsky ...

But it did leave me wondering.
What would a viable, interesting alternative to the world The Wild Wild West showed us [and yes I mean onscreen and in canon this time] look like?

Who would be the good guys?

What would our guys be doing?

Who would be running the show?

What 'Victorian' [seen through the W3 mid 60s lens]
social and gender roles might be different?

What events in history might have happened differently?

What would our guys see as better there if anything at all?

What would they see as worse?

Would their former enemies be allies and vice versa?

Would there be changes that might make them want to stay there?

Would their own past or present be different in a different world?

just for starters those are the questions I'm pondering and will be glad to share my answers when I'm more awake, less fuzzy headed, etc etc

I'm leaving this completely open of course and hope it spurs the lively imaginations populating THIS world ...

what do you think?

[Paradox Eyes]

Interesting subject matter Rielle. About 3 years ago I started a fan-fiction in which our Dr. Loveless accidentally discovers a pathway between parallel lines of existence or alternate universes if you will. I get it out every now and then and write some more. I focused mainly on the characters and very little on the world around them, although things are not the same in that other place at all.

I pretty much left their pasts vague but the results of certain events that occurred differently, absolutely sent them down different paths in this alternate line of existence. And of course the good little Doctor sees opportunity galore in the ability to pick and choose from the parallel world, that which would serve his newest plan best. For me the focus is on the personalities, not the physical world around them.

But in considering some of your questions, I can see creating an alternate universe where the characters and physical world are totally different. For instance if Dr. Loveless and other minds like his rose to the forefront of science in a positive way, what a huge difference that would make. It would assuredly be a more “steam-punk” world with all sorts of inventive creations that would make life easier and more fantastic. A nice fantasy contrast between primitive and futuristic.

And wow, what if roles were reversed in an alternate universe...can you imagine a good Dr. Loveless leading the battle against an evil West and Gordon? Of course at this point you've totally left canon and we're looking at an entirely different premise but with familiar faces. I would never care to do that to that extent with the Wild Wild West.

But if you turned them into allies, then you would need to create a character antithesis worthy of all their combined skills. Since the Doctor is pretty much at the top of the food chain for villains, and West and Gordon at the top for heroes, you might have to move into some off world conflict or into the paranormal arena to get some good adversarial action going.

I know I've kept my commentary restricted to a very small portion of what's been put on the table for discussion but that's my two cents worth at this hour of the morning.

[rielle]

Jul 12, 2012 1:33:20 GMT -8 Paradox Eyes said:

Interesting subject matter Rielle. About 3 years ago I started a fan-fiction in which our Dr. Loveless accidentally discovers a pathway between parallel lines of existence or alternate universes if you will. I get it out every now and then and write some more. I focused mainly on the characters and very little on the world around them, although things are not the same in that other place at all.

thanks for joining in , Paradox, I realize this discussion is close to be OT, since its about taking our guys somewhere else, pretty much, your story certainly does sound intriguing, let us know when you're satisfied with it enough to share...or you need a beta, I can do character and dialogue, other elements though sometimes 'escape me'.. LOL

I pretty much left their pasts vague but the results of certain events that occurred differently, absolutely sent them down different paths in this alternate line of existence. And of course the good little Doctor sees opportunity galore in the ability to pick and choose from the parallel world, that which would serve his newest plan best. For me the focus is on the personalities, not the physical world around them.

But in considering some of your questions, I can see creating an alternate universe where the characters and physical world are totally different. For instance if Dr. Loveless and other minds like his rose to the forefront of science in a positive way, what a huge difference that would make. It would assuredly be a more “steam-punk” world with all sorts of inventive creations that would make life easier and more fantastic. A nice fantasy contrast between primitive and futuristic.

I do like this idea, because in the past couple years I've really started to like steampunk, except for the most Gothic elements which just don't get me, or I don't get them. If Miguelito's inventions were successful and accepted for helping people, who knows where that would take him?

And wow, what if roles were reversed in an alternate universe...can you imagine a good Dr. Loveless leading the battle against an evil West and Gordon? Of course at this point you've totally left canon and we're looking at an entirely different premise but with familiar faces. I would never care to do that to that extent with the Wild Wild West.

yeah, no, I don't care to write our agents as actual bad guys, either. As part of a disguise or undercover task, that's one thing and they both did that, Jim a lot more in Season 1 than later.


But if you turned them into allies, then you would need to create a character antithesis worthy of all their combined skills. Since the Doctor is pretty much at the top of the food chain for villains, and West and Gordon at the top for heroes, you might have to move into some off world conflict or into the paranormal arena to get some good adversarial action going.

well yes, exactly, imo you'd have to get into some really paranormal story ideas for Jim, Artie and the Doctor, or the agents and another upper level villain to be fighting something or someone together. That's why I would likely take a story like this into a whole parallel world setting most likely... one that superficially resembles Victorian era America and or Europe, but actually is far different.

I know I've kept my commentary restricted to a very small portion of what's been put on the table for discussion but that's my two cents worth at this hour of the morning.

[Nydiva]

I've kinda had the idea back in my head (way, way, WAAAAY back) for a story where Artie and Miguelito are the good guy brainy team against the bad brawn of Jim West and Voltaire!!

President Grant is a dictator and Jim is working for him. Artie and Miguelito are revolutionaries trying to overthrow the evil government.

It all turns out a nightmare - but I haven't figured out whose! Jim's, Artie's or Miguelito's?

This is sooooo far on the back burner, that it'll be gathering dust for years. Another moribund plot bunny!!

[rielle]

Okay, here are my own answers as promised, and I surely hope y'all will jump in here and add yours to the mix

Who would be the good guys?
Jim and Artie, for sure, and I would likely include Frank and Jeremy, and then add some originals, or change the roles of some historical characters to add them in as the story called for

1)
What would our guys be doing?

well one idea I had is that they might be working a lot further undercover as government agents, much more as spies, so the feeling might be more like MUNCLE, if you see what I mean. In some ways, that would make their jobs more difficult, I think
OR
the boys might still be Army officers, but involved in what during their War was called the Department/Office of Military Information, this would take more of the stories into their historical setting and events, such as dealing more often with Native Americans
OR
even hmmm... they might start out being Pinkertons, and then get dissatisfied with that and branch out? This is all only talking about what the guys are doing and how they go about it


2)
Who would be running the show?
in case you couldn't tell already I'm fascinated by alternative histories, - And being me, I have way too many ideas for how the Victorian era might be different, especially since it WAS actually very different from the general image of it, just below the surface. - Think about 'Jekyll and Hyde', 'Dracula', 'Dorian Gray' and similar stories and you'll get my meaning - there was an 'underworld'... and far more deeply hidden than that darker world is today- for good or ill

Okay, now to answer the question,
I might posit Jim and Artie finding, for example, instead of a territory or region run by some male political fanatics [REMM, FBTRs, Firebrand, etc, etc] a world run by women... that by itself would be enough to turn everything upside down... especially if those women were kinda like Emma V, only maybe not as murder-minded, who after all kept up ALL appearances as a Victorian lady, so that these hypothetically ruling women would simply have turned the tables on their menfolk a some point.
OR
as many authors have already done and as our guys did at the end of Fire and Brimstone, might posit an alternate world where the Confederacy won - or at least fought the Union to a draw - which was not outside the bounds of reason in '61, 62 or early '63. Would our guys then be renegade Unionists, fighting a guerilla war for the next ten years? Would Lincoln or Grant still be alive?
Would any former Confederates or Unionists change sides? [not Jim or Artie, but I mean politicians or generals]

This same thinking could apply at one remove to the results of the wars in Europe that Jim and Artie knew of, The Crimean War, the Franco Prussian War, and ... a number of others... long distance Wars but still having an effect at home, I'd guess

Having kinda disposed of the third and fourth questions -
What would our guys see as better there if anything at all?

well, that's up to an individual writer of course, I wouldn't mind if some of the mid 60s "Victorian" W3 attitudes towards women were changed by Artie and Jim seeing women as leaders... my bias of course, my opinion, I would have liked seeing the same changes on Star Trek and MUNCLE,


Would there be changes that might make them want to stay there?

my answer here is actually, no, these agents of ours are just like we are today woven into our own times, I think as long as we realize that the world and the times that Jim and Artie belong in and thrive in is the Victorian era through the lens of the mid to late 60s- same with Star Trek and MUNCLE - only thing is ST could take things much further, being set 'in the future' and Man From Uncle could take things a little further, being set in that present day-


Would Jim and Artie's pasts be changed in an alternate/parallel world?

I'd say that was highly likely. The whole concept of a parallel world suggests people and events have all changed to some extent- building a different time and place-
Jim might have been a career Army officer, [whether or not he went to West Point]
Artie might have kept at least the cover story of working as an actor whilst working on cases with James
Lily might have agreed to marry Artie... love ya Lil, think about it, k?
I would never go so far as to say either agent would have fought for the Confederacy, that's just not how Garrison and Co. created them to be. '

Where they might differ in an alternate world ...
dunno, maybe Artie would be more 'street smart' and Jim would show off his education more often... jkjkjk, but I do admire that right hook Ross shows off from time to time... Casual Killer for one, and I think again in Fire and Brimstone... And I do love it when Jim shows us that he does know the difference between fine piece of beef and a French poet even though they have the same name: Chateaubriand.



okay, okay on to other ideas brewing... LOL

[rielle]

Jul 13, 2012 15:05:10 GMT -8 Nydiva said:

I've kinda had the idea back in my head (way, way, WAAAAY back) for a story where Artie and Miguelito are the good guy brainy team against the bad brawn of Jim West and Voltaire!!

President Grant is a dictator and Jim is working for him. Artie and Miguelito are revolutionaries trying to overthrow the evil government.

It all turns out a nightmare - but I haven't figured out whose! Jim's, Artie's or Miguelito's?

This is sooooo far on the back burner, that it'll be gathering dust for years. Another moribund plot bunny!!

'diva I haveta say I love this plotline... hope you will dig it out and write it for us some time